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 The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs

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Last_Jedi_Standing
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PostSubject: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Sun Oct 21, 2012 10:30 pm

The list of sets that will be in the first 2013 wave of Star Wars LEGO sets has been around for a while, but I just found the complete information today, and I am very happy. Very happy indeed. Because, you see, I have gone to considerable effort to collect an entire platoon of Phase I clone trooper minifigures - 36 figures in all, all of them identical. They are all Phase I privates. But that is not as it should be. A platoon should include 32 privates, 3 sergeants, and a lieutenant. The problem with that is that until now, LEGO did not make clone troopers with ranks other than private, so my platoon has been incomplete. This has been a source of frustration for five years, but there wasn't anything I could do about it. I tried painting some of my figures to get officers, but it didn't really work. But now - or at least soon - LEGO will produce clone trooper sergeants. This makes me very happy indeed, because I can finally have a complete platoon. Or almost, anyway. I still need a lieutenant. But the thing about LEGO is that once they've done something once, they're much more likely to do it again. I am confident that, fairly soon, we will be seeing lieutenants and captains and generic commanders and all sorts of wonderful things. So I am very happy. Very happy indeed.

For anyone here who's interested, here is a link to the complete list of upcoming Star Wars LEGO sets. There's a lot of cool stuff there besides the sergeants - in fact, for most people, the sergeants will be among the least cool things there. They're just special to me because of how long I've waited for that particular figure.

Very Happy

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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Sun Oct 21, 2012 10:33 pm

Your apparent joy over a trivial topic confuses me. Please explain.
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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Sun Oct 21, 2012 10:35 pm

ACH0225 wrote:
Your apparent joy over a trivial topic confuses me. Please explain.
I know I'm somewhat crazy, and it is pretty trivial, but something that I've been waiting for for five years has finally happened. I think anyone would be excited if something similar happened to them.

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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Sun Oct 21, 2012 10:56 pm

/me Shakes head

*ACH0225 Shakes head

I waited at least a decade for a law to be passed, wasn't too excited.
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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Mon Oct 22, 2012 5:46 am

For humans, 5 years is around 14% of the expected lifespan.
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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 12:58 pm

Could you please explain which set contains the higher ranked Clone troopers?
Cause I can´t differenciate the ranks at all.
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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 1:18 pm

Surp. Grm. Ivan Kintobor wrote:
Could you please explain which set contains the higher ranked Clone troopers?
Cause I can´t differenciate the ranks at all.
The clone trooper sergeant is in the Clone Troopers and Droidekas battlepack. There aren't any ranks other than sergeant yet. The sergeant is the one with green arms and green markings on his helmet and chest.

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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 1:21 pm

I'll have to consider picking up two of the Droideka ones, then. I managed to dig up two full squads of clones last night.

I also saw one of the predicted sets on eBay this morning...you wouldn't happen to have ETAs on when these sets are coming out, would you?
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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 1:25 pm

Tiel wrote:
I'll have to consider picking up two of the Droideka ones, then. I managed to dig up two full squads of clones last night.

I also saw one of the predicted sets on eBay this morning...you wouldn't happen to have ETAs on when these sets are coming out, would you?
Should be January or February of next year. It's not impossible that someone got one early somehow, but I probably wouldn't trust that guy.

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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 1:33 pm

BELOW


Last edited by Tiel on Tue Oct 23, 2012 1:35 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 1:35 pm

Last_Jedi_Standing wrote:
A platoon should include 32 privates, 4 sergeants, and a lieutenant.

Every squad has a sergeant plus eight privates, according to wikipedia.
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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 1:39 pm

Tiel wrote:
Last_Jedi_Standing wrote:
A platoon should include 32 privates, 4 sergeants, and a lieutenant.

Every squad has a sergeant plus eight privates, according to wikipedia.
Yes, but one of the squads is lead by the lieutenant. He replaces a sergeant.

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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 1:46 pm

I was under the impression the lieutenant was an officer and thus merely an addon to a unit, similar to Admirals and Captains in naval battles.

edit:

"In the Grand Army of the Republic, a standard platoon of clone troopers consisted of 4 squads, each led by a sergeant, a total of 40 soldiers, led by a Lieutenant, giving a total of 41 clones to a platoon."
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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 2:46 pm

Tiel wrote:
I was under the impression the lieutenant was an officer and thus merely an addon to a unit, similar to Admirals and Captains in naval battles.

edit:

"In the Grand Army of the Republic, a standard platoon of clone troopers consisted of 4 squads, each led by a sergeant, a total of 40 soldiers, led by a Lieutenant, giving a total of 41 clones to a platoon."
I am aware of that line. It comes from the article on platoons. It is directly contradicted by the article on squads, and indirectly by most of the other unit pages. Given the lack of definitive sources, I picked the one that I thought made more sense and was given in more places.

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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 3:05 pm

A lieutenant leading a squad doesn't make sense, he has overall command of the platoon. Subdivisions are handled by his underlings.

An admiral doesn't command the ship he resides in, he commands the fleet with maybe a little priority to the starship he's attached to.
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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 4:29 pm

Tiel wrote:
A lieutenant leading a squad doesn't make sense, he has overall command of the platoon. Subdivisions are handled by his underlings.

An admiral doesn't command the ship he resides in, he commands the fleet with maybe a little priority to the starship he's attached to.
In the GAR officers fight on the front lines with the privates. Once you get to the higher ranks, commander and so on, I think that squad serves as a personal bodyguard or some such. There isn't much definitive information that I've been able to find, and I've spent a lot of time looking. One of the few sources that gives good numbers is the Guide to the Grand Army of the Republic, a canon article by Karen Traviss that was published in Issue 84 of Star Wars Insider. I have a copy of that issue, and on page 26 it says:

REGULAR ARMY: STRENGTH AND COMMANDS STRUCTURE

GRAND ARMY
10 Systems Army + additional (3,000,000) with the Supreme Chancellor and Commander in Chief

SYSTEMS ARMY
2 Sectors Army (294,912) led by a High Jedi General (Council Member)

SECTOR ARMY
4 corps (147,456) led by a Senior Jedi General (Jedi Master)

CORPS
4 legions (36,864 troops) led by a Clone Marshal Commander and a Jedi General

LEGION/BRIGADE
4 regiments (9216 troops) led by a Senior Clone Commander and a Jedi General

REGIMENT
Battalions (2304 troops) led by a Jedi Padawan Commander

BATTALION
4 companies (576 troops) led by a Major

COMPANY
4 platoons (144 troops) led by a Captain

PLATOON
4 squads (36 troops) led by a Lieutenant

SQUAD
9 troopers led by a Sergeant


We know that the Sergeant counts as one of the 9 troopers. That's not in question. It therefore stands to reason that the higher ranks are included in the numbers, too. Also, that's the only way the math works out.

9 x 4 = 36
36 x 4 = 144
144 x 4 = 576
576 x 4 = 2304
2304 x 4 = 9216
9216 x 4 = 36,864
36,864 x 4 = 147,456

And so on. There's no room in there for the officers not to be counted in their squads. It makes a lot less sense for the officers not to be counted in the number of soldiers in a Systems Army.

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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 4:53 pm

Well, I mean, I'm thinking of WW2 or Halo stuff where the CO is still very much combat capable but considered more of an attache to a particular squad than its leader, which is really the sergeant, whom acts as a proxy for the LT's orders to all the squads under his command.

Now, Captain Rex led a full company of troopers during the assault on Umbara. It didn't appear to me that he had a personal squad for him to command in addition to the overall ground force, to me at least.
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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 4:59 pm

Tiel wrote:
Now, Captain Rex led a full company of troopers during the assault on Umbara. It didn't appear to me that he had a personal squad for him to command in addition to the overall ground force, to me at least.
Rex's position in the ORBAT is so broken already that that doesn't really surprise me. I mean, he's a captain, but he seems to be doing the job of at least a Senior Commander, leading the 501st alongside a Jedi General. So I have no idea what his situation is. I will note, however, that he seemed to spend a lot of time with Jesse, Tup, Hardcase, and the rest of those guys. Their roles weren't clearly defined, but is it too much of a stretch to guess that they were his command squad? They may well not have been. That's nothing but conjecture on my part. But it seems to fit the episodes.

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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 5:28 pm

Last_Jedi_Standing wrote:
Tiel wrote:
Now, Captain Rex led a full company of troopers during the assault on Umbara. It didn't appear to me that he had a personal squad for him to command in addition to the overall ground force, to me at least.
Rex's position in the ORBAT is so broken already that that doesn't really surprise me. I mean, he's a captain, but he seems to be doing the job of at least a Senior Commander, leading the 501st alongside a Jedi General. So I have no idea what his situation is. I will note, however, that he seemed to spend a lot of time with Jesse, Tup, Hardcase, and the rest of those guys. Their roles weren't clearly defined, but is it too much of a stretch to guess that they were his command squad? They may well not have been. That's nothing but conjecture on my part. But it seems to fit the episodes.

Technically Rex only leads Torrent Company, and apparently Skywalker prizes them as his elite cadre of troops he can depend on, presumably deploying them wherever possible within reason. We also see Anakin leaving to participate in other theaters of war while leaving Torrent behind where they're needed under the command of either solely Rex or another Jedi, one case being Pong Krell.

You do make a good point about Denel, Fives, Echo etc. They certainly do tend to gravitate towards Rex in most of the episodes, though one thing you're saying here is a 'command squad', as in the handpicked soldiers chosen by an officer to protect them. Now, Rex's situation is different in that he's commanding 144 soldiers, nine wouldn't be particularly missed on the frontline to be allocated to his personal squad. I was under the impression you're saying that an ordinary squad is going to be commanded by solely a lieutenant without a sergeant for micro-managing, which doesn't really make sense in a small unit such as a platoon to me.
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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 5:56 pm

Who needs clones and droids when you have storm troopers?



And I think clone wars is a little weird because the clones (which are basically storm troopers) actually hit things when they shoot
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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 6:05 pm

Stormtroopers aren't necessarily clones. They induct, recruit, and clone into the organization, which leads to sub-standard performance in many cases. It's also been noted that the E-11 carbine apparently gains a lot of accuracy with a stock attached due to excessive recoil.

The Corps have more powerful weaponry and are the best the Empire has to offer, but the Grand Army of the Republic had the most elite infantry the galaxy ever saw.
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PostSubject: Re: The Next Wave of Star Wars LEGOs   Tue Oct 23, 2012 7:16 pm

Tiel wrote:
Last_Jedi_Standing wrote:
Tiel wrote:
Now, Captain Rex led a full company of troopers during the assault on Umbara. It didn't appear to me that he had a personal squad for him to command in addition to the overall ground force, to me at least.
Rex's position in the ORBAT is so broken already that that doesn't really surprise me. I mean, he's a captain, but he seems to be doing the job of at least a Senior Commander, leading the 501st alongside a Jedi General. So I have no idea what his situation is. I will note, however, that he seemed to spend a lot of time with Jesse, Tup, Hardcase, and the rest of those guys. Their roles weren't clearly defined, but is it too much of a stretch to guess that they were his command squad? They may well not have been. That's nothing but conjecture on my part. But it seems to fit the episodes.

Technically Rex only leads Torrent Company, and apparently Skywalker prizes them as his elite cadre of troops he can depend on, presumably deploying them wherever possible within reason. We also see Anakin leaving to participate in other theaters of war while leaving Torrent behind where they're needed under the command of either solely Rex or another Jedi, one case being Pong Krell.

You do make a good point about Denel, Fives, Echo etc. They certainly do tend to gravitate towards Rex in most of the episodes, though one thing you're saying here is a 'command squad', as in the handpicked soldiers chosen by an officer to protect them. Now, Rex's situation is different in that he's commanding 144 soldiers, nine wouldn't be particularly missed on the frontline to be allocated to his personal squad. I was under the impression you're saying that an ordinary squad is going to be commanded by solely a lieutenant without a sergeant for micro-managing, which doesn't really make sense in a small unit such as a platoon to me.
No, that's exactly what I was saying. I probably shouldn't have used the term 'command squad'. I just meant the squad that Rex had replaced the sergeant of. Presumably this would be Squad A, Platoon A of Torrent Company. Captain is a low enough rank that he probably doesn't need people to be the equivalent of administrative assistants, but I think he would if he were a few notches up the command chain. A full commander would have enough bureaucratic duties that he might need people to do filing or whatever. That probably wouldn't be needed for a lowly captain, but the principle is the same. Squad A, Platoon A is composed of 8 privates and a captain. Squad A, Platoon A, Company A, Battalion A, is composed of 8 privates and a commander. I guess I don't know about having a sergeant as a second in command of the squad. I haven't seen anything that would suggest that that was true, but information is scarce enough that that's not proof. I suppose there is some precedent in the existence of corporals in the GAR, but I'm not sure than can be extended to this.

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